Quote from cargame.nl :

No, I don't think setup data is being send encrypted to every client while connected to a server, would be a waste of resources. But the setup data is there after connection because it otherwise is not possible to save a replay.

It is sent encrypted to avoid people getting it from network packets. Is is encrypted in the file to avoid people getting it from replays. But hackers worked out how LFS gets the key and they got it from files. It is decrypted in memory so LFS can render other people's cars appearance and physics properly, and hackers also can find this in memory.

Quote from Becky Rose :

If you can't fight it, make it available to everyone.

So either tougher encryption, or change the culture by allowing everyone to use anyone's set (there might be some resistance initially, but it would get accepted soon enough).

In real racing you can walk about the paddock, talk to drivers, look at their cars, and gain a lot of information. At international level you can use photography and analysis tools to garner toe and camber data - sound analysis for gearing and so on - heck, F1 teams steal and buy each others secret data routinely...

Apart from a league race long enough for fuel stops even that is simply "enough for the race".

It's not exactly rocket science to work out tyre choice or pressure.

So what's the big secret? Only because hackers have something others don't... So lets change the landscape and just open up setups for everyone.

Quote from Anthoop :

Would it not be fairer then to make set up sharing mandatory?
Instead of having "SS" (send set) in the connection box, just have "S"...click it and name it.

I do think this is worth considering.

Changes from 0.6E16 to 0.6E17 :

Translation updates for most languages

Fixes for old bugs :

OOS error after an idle car was hit by objects
OOS error when an car was pushed out of bounds
Joining car could not enter physics when many objects were moving

https://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=85807

Oh yes, I know LFS needs some new content. There won't be any new content for demo racers though, but they will get physics updates and so on.

Quote from edge3147 :

Windows has and will remain the dominate platform for PC gaming.

In the end, they will fail if they use these strongarm tactics. You can't force people to give you money for no real reason. On their current path they will end up with angry users and they will leave. Their current path must (and may) change. I have some vague memory hearing something a few months ago that Bill Gates might be a getting little more involved again and Mr Ballmer is leaving... is that true? Maybe that would help? I may really be off the mark here but in my imagination, Bill Gates was kind of into the technology aspect of things but Ballmer was into money making. I really haven't researched that, it's just a vague impression so if I am wrong or anyone has some better info, please let us know!

Quote from edge3147 :

There are plenty of ways for Mac and Linux users to use LFS without having to specifically cater to that specific OS.

I haven't heard of any ways to run DX10 / DX11 software on Linux or Mac. I am under the impression you must use Wine and it supports up to DX9.

I haven't been catering specifically to those systems in any way. I haven't spent even 5 minutes trying to cater to them. LFS worked in DX8 on those systems (using Wine) but actually it works better on them after the DX9 conversion because it's better supported (I think that is the case, but again, this is a bit vague and not researched, don't really know much about Wine).

Quote from edge3147 :

At this current pace, I see everyone leaving and complaining because again, the developers vision doesn't match what the player base wants.

Our vision is new physics and new content, followed by some other interesting things like dynamic track conditions.

People can 'leave' if they want to. I don't even have a concept of leaving and returning, LFS is just here for license holders to have a go when they want to, obviously that is more likely when there is an update.

Quote from edge3147 :

I think it is pretty clear that over the last 5 years since the announcement of VWS and Rockingham, people are more concerned with having the game updated and refreshed rather than all of this other development that has taken place.

The current 3D patch is one of those diversions that is actually quite exciting for me and some people. I have always wanted to be in there in virtual reality and hopefully that will happen within two months! But I agree it has probably slowed some other things down. However, that has nothing to do with catering for old / other operating systems. Just a few days during these months on the new 3D system were spent upgrading from DX8 to DX9 because DX9 is a better standard than DX8. And that had no effect on other operating systems, it was just moving LFS one step towards more recent DirectX versions.

Quote from edge3147 :

Whatever you decide to do, you will always have someone that is upset. The question is, do you want to have a majority of the player base upset because of the lack of progress or would you rather have a fraction of the player base upset because of loss of support of hardware/software.

Again, I don't see the connection. There wouldn't be faster progress on the things people want (content, physics, etc) if we used DX10 or DX11. They just don't affect that at all. I'm simply not spending any time at all catering for these other systems. In fact I would spend more time trying to change LFS to use DX10 and DX11, but won't do so because there isn't any reason to do so.

Sorry but the tyre physics will not be ready in the incompatible patch.

EDIT : This test is now finished.
The updates are now in the full version.
www.lfs.net



WARNING : THIS IS A TEST

NOTE : THIS DOES NOT CONTAIN NEW TYRE PHYSICS / VW SCIROCCO / ROCKINGHAM

PLEASE TEST BEFORE YOU POST

NO OFF-TOPIC FEATURE REQUESTS

NO UNRELATED COMMENTS


Hello Racers, here is a new TEST PATCH : 0.6E19

This test patch is fully compatible with version 0.6E

It now uses DirectX 9
There are not many graphical changes yet but some people report better frame rates
Mirror antialiasing has been implemented (Options - Graphics)
Screenshots can now be saved in bmp / jpg / png format (Options - Misc)

The Oculus Rift and many 3D TVs and monitors are now supported
See "How to enable stereoscopic 3D" below

You cannot upload hotlaps made with this test patch because it is only a test patch, not an official patch

Please keep a backup of your LFS.exe from 0.6E so you can easily go back if there are any problems


Changes from 0.6E18 to 0.6E19 :

FIX : Dedicated server would not start up in reversed or open configs


Changes from 0.6E17 to 0.6E18 :

More translations have been updated and corrected
Random weather selected by default when loading a track
Message "Track loaded" now shows which track was loaded

Commands :

/track command (change track) accepts a weather parameter
e.g. /track BL2R 3 <- selects 3rd weather on Blackwood 2 reversed

Fixes for new bugs :

Selected track image vanished if /weather command was used

Fixes for old bugs :

Joining host OOS if host started with invalid /weather value


Changes from 0.6E16 to 0.6E17 :

Translation updates for most languages

Fixes for old bugs :

OOS error after an idle car was hit by objects
OOS error when an car was pushed out of bounds
Joining car could not enter physics when many objects were moving


Changes from 0.6E15 to 0.6E16 :

The 3D support is now translatable - awaiting translations
Improved and optimised the Oculus Rift distortion function
Some other small performance optimisations in graphics code
FIX : Mouse drag movement in SHIFT+U mode in 3D modes


Changes from 0.6E to 0.6E15 :

3D device support :

Select 3D near the top of View Options to select device
Supports Oculus Rift, 3D monitors, projectors, TVs, headsets

Various :

LFS now uses DirectX 9 (previously used DirectX 8.1)
Mirror antialiasing is now available (in Graphics Options)
Misc option to select CTRL+S screenshot format (bmp / jpg / png)
CTRL+ and ALT+ (assign text to F keys) visible in mouse / kb mode
Lateral and longitudinal accelerometer now works realistically
Improved transitions when switching between interface screens

Commands :

/refresh refreshes list of setups / hosts / replays
/setup now works correctly (loads setup) in garage screen
/join hostname from entry screen now tries to join the named host
/exec and /wait can now take filenames with spaces in quotes
/colour and /setup without a parameter now select default

Fixes for old bugs :

Some glitches in the movement of vertical sliders
Helmet stayed the same after changing driver in MP replays
Some controllers could make mouse axes unavailable for use
MAX ALPHA (unsorted) message after adding 900 chalk objects
High frequency changes in acceleration were filtered in OutSim
LFS would crash if more than 8 game controllers were connected
Cleaner transition from track select back to race setup screen
Text entry was not always cleared when entering the meeting room
F key text was delayed if pressed in warning or selection dialog
Stuck in game after Alt+F4 / X button after edit in SHIFT+U mode
Setup could sometimes be corrupted when joining - now spectated
NumConns was set to zero after disconnecting from an online host
Arrow keys in input dialog were re-enabled by code page selector


HOW TO ENABLE STEREOSCOPIC 3D :

1) At the top of the View options screen, select 3D mode.

2) Select your Display type - three options are available :

- TV / monitor / projector
- Conventional 3D headset
- Oculus Rift

Each mode has different characteristics.

- TV / monitor / projector mode - it is important to set your horizontal screen width, measured in mm. Not the diagonal, just the horizontal measurement from one side to the other. This, in conjunction with the interpupillary distance, should set the image up properly if you set the FOV to match the true horizontal view angle between your eyes and the TV edges. The virtual eye positions are affected and the centres of the two images displayed on the screen are offset by the same distance so the horizon appears to be in the distance.

- Conventional 3D headset - also has an interpupillary distance slider but in this case it only affects the virtual eye positions. There is no compensation for the use of wider FOV angles than actually available. So if you use wider FOV than the true horizontal FOV of the device, you will see exaggerated depth.

- Oculus Rift - this will try to load a DLL and connect to your Oculus Rift and from there it will get the interpupillary distance and other values, and head tracking should work.

3) In TV / monitor / projector or Conventional 3D headset modes, select your Format for 3D output - four options are available :

- side by side (half)
- top and bottom (half)
- side by side (full)
- top and bottom (full)

Choose the setting that works with your device. Many devices can accept different input formats.

- side by side (half) is a commonly used format that causes some loss of resolution in the horizontal direction.

- top and bottom (half) causes loss of resolution in the vertical direction. This is the best choice for passive displays with alternating polarisation horizontal scan lines. This type of display discards half of the lines if supplied with a full height image. When supplied with half height images, no further information needs to be discarded.

- side by side (full) and top and bottom (full) can output 3D at full HD resolution to a device that supports this. However, most devices do not support this output (even if they can accept full HD 3D from a Blu-ray player). In Windows XP it was possible to set your desktop across two screens and then LFS could go full screen on two screens. Then side by side (full) could be used, for example, to send output to a twin projector 3D setup. Unfortunately this possibility seems to have been removed from recent versions of Windows.

4) For Oculus Rift mode some text functions have been included.

/rift reset - reset the orientation
/rift on - switch on 3D with Oculus Rift as the display type
/rift off - return to 2D mode
/rift toggle - switch Oculus Rift mode on or off

The /rift reset command is automatically assigned to ALT+F12
The /rift toggle command is automatically assigned to ALT+F11

You can assign ALT+F11 and ALT+F12 to wheel buttons under the ALT+ tab in the controls options screen.

5) Screen resolutions for your Oculus Rift.

Now that LFS adjusts the render target texture size to suit the output screen size, you may benefit from downsampling if you select a higher screen resolution than the native resolution of the Rift. This may produce some helpful antialiasing. Try to select a 16:10 resolution (e.g. 1920x1200) because that has the same aspect ratio as the Dev Kit's native resolution (1280x800). If you select a 16:9 resolution (e.g. 1920x1080) you should check carefully that the output image has the correct aspect ratio. This seems to vary between computers. Some have reported that the image looks the same in 1920x1200 and 1920x1080 but others report that 1920x1080 causes the image to be slightly stretched vertically. You need to make sure the dimensions appear the same as when you choose the native resolution of 1280x800. If you find the image is stretched vertically when you use 1920x1080, you can try the Aspect ratio correction option, or look at the GPU scaling setting (in your graphics card driver software).

There is a device selector in LFS which may allow you to put LFS on the Rift without it appearing on your monitor, and to do this without touching any Windows desktop settings. This is probably available when your desktop is set to extended mode. Using the device selector may make more modes available to you than when you use cloned mode.

At the bottom of the Graphics Options screen, just above the Z-buffer depth option, there is a button which has the name of your graphics card. If you click that button you may be able to select the Oculus Rift device which will be used the next time you start LFS.


NOT YET DONE (some of these will be done) :

- render mirrors in 3d
- chromatic aberration correction
- allow head tracking and wheel button instead of mouse
- replay cameras (TV view) may be put on a virtual monitor
- include object selection buttons in SHIFT+U mode


INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS :

A full version of LFS 0.6E must already be installed - www.lfs.net

To install the PATCH using the SELF EXTRACTING ARCHIVE :

1) Move or save the patch into your main LFS folder
2) Double click the patch to extract it to that folder
3) When you see "Confirm File Replace" select "Yes to All"
4) Now you can start LFS in the normal way

NOTE : You can see if the patch is correctly installed when you run
the program. At the bottom of the entry screen : 0.6E19


DOWNLOAD :

TEST PATCH 0.6E19 (SELF EXTRACTING ARCHIVE) (if you already have 0.6E) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_PATCH_6E_TO_6E19.exe (1.3 MB)

TEST PATCH 0.6E19 (ALTERNATIVE ZIP) (if you already have 0.6E) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_PATCH_6E_TO_6E19.zip (1.5 MB)

DEDICATED HOST 0.6E19 (non-graphical version for hosting only) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_S2_DCON_6E19.zip (1.5 MB)

Last edited by Scawen, Sun 22 Jun 2014, 09:12.

Quote from Neilser :

Is it really the case that the physics loop is still updating at 100 Hz even when the CPU is pegged and the graphics update rate falls to 30 fps or less?

Yes, so the physics is always consistent and stable regardless of graphical overload.

Quote from Neilser :

(I confess I have yet to try the DX9 patch as I was assuming it would make things worse.)

No harm in trying it as you can just run whichever exe you prefer - there's no complicated roll-back!

No need to apologise!

Seems it wasn't clearly known. It made me think a bit, what are we doing with that wasted time, waiting for the vertical sync... nothing? You could possibly introduce an artificial delay between 2 physics updates that happen in one frame, to read an extra input between the two physics updates (so you'd read two inputs with a tiny time gap between them instead of just one). But you might risk missing the vertical sync and cause a glitch and I'm not convinced it would help in any way. Or maybe a multithreaded system with the physics and graphics totally decoupled, but the physics system would need to save "consistent visual states" for any graphical update that comes along while doing the next physical update.

Complicated stuff with a lot of bug potential... maybe the solution is 100Hz monitors. Yes, that is the proper solution!

OT : Also in my opinion (and some others) TV makers and standards setters should be looking at higher frame rate displays, recording and transmission systems, instead of just higher and higher pixel counts that you need a magnifying glass to see. Higher frame rates don't even need much more bandwidth because less of the screen changes between frames...

Just to confirm what I think is well known... the inputs and outputs are only done at the frame rate. There's no point taking inputs between 2 physics updates done in a single visual frame because there is so little time between them. So the best solution is 100Hz frame rate, not possible with current monitors with vertical sync enabled.

Quote from DANIEL-CRO :

I tested with how many times per second car physics data is updated, I would clearly say its affected by vsync/fps limit.

Well... either I'm not sure what you mean, or you are mistaken.

For example, try running a hotlap replay. If there is a difference in the number of physics calculations, the replay will go out of sync. Every physics update is run at a time step of 0.01 seconds, and LFS tries to keep this in sync with real time by doing enough physics calculations to keep up with real time.

Quote from DANIEL-CRO :

So to sum it all up, question for Scawen.
Is it possible to use VSYNC (e.g. 60FPS), without affecting to physics loop. Like physics run at 100Hz (or more?), but graphics 60FPS?

The physics always runs at 100Hz, even with graphics at 60FPS but this means the number of physics frames per visual frame is variable, like 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2 etc.

Quote from cougar8 :

So i get E13 working and when i went to change my car on a server it crashes hear is a screenshot

Windows is looking for a solution! Obviously it will not find one! Would be more helpful if it told you the crash address. Seriously, MS is going nuts these days.

- Are you able to change your car while in single player?
- Does this happen every time?
- Is it possible in your version of Windows to get a crash address?

You mean the shadows of the world objects? The ones that are all spiky and messy? I agree they are a problem but there's no quick solution for that. Really I want to get to the point where the sun can move in the sky and the shadows can move, as part of a changing weather system.

But this is after a tyre physics update. I'm trying to get realistic about the tyre physics update, to make a good solid version that works well and makes LFS cars feel great (because of the force combinations that are mathematically based) with good simulation of tyre load sensitivity but not worry too much about extreme detail as it will never exactly match reality.

Dear Racers,

I am going to close this thread because I don't like the title coming up and being the first thing on LFS forum all the time. It's really negative and not good for new visitors to see.

We're working on LFS. There was a slowdown in development after a decade of hard work but we are back on the case now.

There's a new 3D support test patch which isn't for everyone, but what is interesting (apart from LFS working well on any 3D TV) is that the Oculus Rift is now supported and that works well with LFS.

I've also started on the DX9 support, which will not change the appearance immediately but will help with future graphical development.

The plan is to get back on the tyre physics after the 3D patch and DX9 support.

Quote from yeager :

Clearly the developers don't have the time to dedicate to the solution. That is a real shame. But they also don't have the acumen to take advantage of the dedicated community the game has accrued. If the devs need more money, then charge a monthly subscription and in return deliver some new content. I would absolutely pay a reasonable amount a month if I knew there was going to be a new track in the next 3 months. Many people have cried out asking to provide help, only to be ignored. If people are TRYING to help you, and you are struggling financially to progress the game, then you gotta find a way to work it out.

Hi yeager,

I just wanted to explain that progress hasn't been slow due to lack of time or funding. We have had plenty of time and enough money to live in a nice warm house with plenty of food to eat and a good internet connection. I see it more like an inevitable temporary slowdown after a decade of hard work with long hours. A slowdown that started in my case when the tyre physics development took me on a journey of discovery with no easy way out until I eventually gained a few new interests which I got excited about.

I posted something recently which I'm not sure if you read.
https://www.lfsforum.net/showt ... php?p=1823294#post1823294

Anyway, funding wouldn't help at all, we have plenty of time. The only way money could help is if we got an office and started hiring people. But we have no interest in that at all. Our motivation is more on the side of what interests us, rather than what makes the most money. We're not that type of capitalists at all and don't want to manage a team of developers. That is totally out of the question. It's actually quite an alien thought to me that money can make development happen quicker.

Having said that, we do need to earn a decent living and that is one part of the motivation to get back on the case and get the new physics out then S3. Also we have certain aims for the project and want to see them done.

I don't really mind if people say it's too little too late or we have squandered our opportunity and LFS is dead. Doesn't really matter, the dip happened, I've stopped smoking and got fit, and that's OK with me. At the moment I'm working and cycling too. Doesn't have to be one or the other. I can't worry that people had to wait longer than they wanted to. I'm hoping to make some good progress in the coming months.

WARNING : THIS IS A TEST

NOTE : THIS DOES NOT CONTAIN NEW TYRE PHYSICS / VW SCIROCCO / ROCKINGHAM

PLEASE TEST BEFORE YOU POST

NO OFF-TOPIC FEATURE REQUESTS

NO UNRELATED COMMENTS


Hello Racers, here is a new TEST PATCH : 0.6E14

This test patch is fully compatible with version 0.6E

It now uses DirectX 9 instead of DirectX 8.1 (no graphical changes yet but some people report better frame rates)

The Oculus Rift and many 3D TVs and monitors are now supported (see "How to enable stereoscopic 3D" below)

You cannot upload hotlaps made with this test patch because it is only a test patch, not an official patch

Please keep a backup of your LFS.exe from 0.6E so you can easily go back if there are any problems


Changes from 0.6E13 to 0.6E14 :

Graphics :

Cars and drivers in menu screens are now antialiased
New Graphics Option : Mirror antialiasing

Oculus Rift :

New option : Antialiasing - NOTE : this reduces frame rate a lot...

Fixes :

FIX : Setup could (rarely) be corrupted when joining. Now detected and spectated with message.
FIX : NumConns was set to an invalid value of zero after disconnecting from an online host.
FIX : Arrow keys were re-enabled in the input dialog by using the code page selector.


Changes from 0.6E12 to 0.6E13 :

DirectX 9 fixes :

FIX : LFS did not get past the entry screen if Haze effect was disabled
FIX : Anisotropic filtering (Texture filtering / AF slider > 1) did not work

Other fixes :

FIX : Starting LFS in full screen set mouse cursor to top left - now centre
FIX : FOV in helicopter view is now back to the same as it was before
FIX : Credits screen had a black background


Changes from 0.6E11 to 0.6E12 :

DirectX 9 :

LFS now uses DirectX 9 instead of DirectX 8.1 (no visual changes)

Fixes :

FIX : Mirror texture is now 32-bit (as it was until recently)
FIX : Suspension view in garage did not work in 3D modes


Changes from 0.6E10 to 0.6E11 :

Oculus Rift :

Aspect ratio correction option - helps in some cases when using 1920x1080

Fixes for new bugs :

FIX : Black background in pits screen when in game
FIX : Driver was invisible in driver options screen
FIX : Distance measurement tool in SHIFT+U mode was invisible

Fixes for old bugs :

FIX : MAX ALPHA (unsorted) message after adding 900 chalk objects
FIX : LFS would crash if more than 8 game controllers were connected
FIX : Alt+F4 / X button from SHIFT+U mode after editing got stuck in game


Changes from 0.6E8 to 0.6E10 :

3D Support :

Simple HUD aspect ratio option for 3D modes in view options screen
SHIFT+U mode mouse view control now works in stereoscopic 3D modes

Oculus Rift :

Oculus Rift vertical FOV is now calculated (manual option also available)
Realistic eye positions and simple neck model moves eyes with head tracking

Fixes :

FIX : Some glitches in the movement of vertical sliders
FIX : Sliders moved twice as far as mouse in some 3D modes
FIX : Cleaner transition from track selection back to race setup screen
FIX : Rare crash that could happen when more buttons appeared on the screen


Changes from 0.6E to 0.6E8 :

Support for stereoscopic 3D monitors, projectors, TVs and headsets
Lateral and longitudinal accelerometer values now work realistically
CTRL+ and ALT+ (assign text to F keys) visible in mouse / kb mode
Improved transitions when switching between interface screens

FIX : High frequency changes in acceleration were filtered in OutSim
FIX : Helmet stayed the same after changing driver in MP replays


HOW TO ENABLE STEREOSCOPIC 3D :

1) In the View options screen, select 3D mode on the second line.

2) Select your Display type - three options are available :

- TV / monitor / projector
- Conventional 3D headset
- Oculus Rift

Each mode has different characteristics.

- TV / monitor / projector mode - it is important to set your horizontal screen width, measured in mm. Not the diagonal, just the horizontal measurement from one side to the other. This, in conjunction with the interpupillary distance, should set the image up properly if you set the FOV to match the true horizontal view angle between your eyes and the TV edges. The virtual eye positions are affected and the centres of the two images displayed on the screen are offset by the same distance so the horizon appears to be in the distance.

- Conventional 3D headset - also has an interpupillary distance slider but in this case it only affects the virtual eye positions. There is no compensation for the use of wider FOV angles than actually available. So if you use wider FOV than the true horizontal FOV of the device, you will see exaggerated depth.

- Oculus Rift - this will try to load a DLL and connect to your Oculus Rift and from there it will get the interpupillary distance and other values, and head tracking should work.

3) In TV / monitor / projector or Conventional 3D headset modes, select your Format for 3D output - four options are available :

- side by side (half)
- top and bottom (half)
- side by side (full)
- top and bottom (full)

Choose the setting that works with your device. Many devices can accept different input formats.

- side by side (half) is a commonly used format that causes some loss of resolution in the horizontal direction.

- top and bottom (half) causes loss of resolution in the vertical direction. This is the best choice for passive displays with alternating polarisation horizontal scan lines. This type of display discards half of the lines if supplied with a full height image. When supplied with half height images, no further information needs to be discarded.

- side by side (full) and top and bottom (full) can output 3D at full HD resolution to a device that supports this. However, most devices do not support this output (even if they can accept full HD 3D from a Blu-ray player). In Windows XP it was possible to set your desktop across two screens and then LFS could go full screen on two screens. Then side by side (full) could be used, for example, to send output to a twin projector 3D setup. Unfortunately this possibility seems to have been removed from recent versions of Windows.

4) For Oculus Rift mode some text functions have been included.

/rift reset - reset the orientation
/rift on - switch on 3D with Oculus Rift as the display type
/rift off - return to 2D mode
/rift toggle - switch Oculus Rift mode on or off

The /rift reset command is automatically assigned to ALT+F12
The /rift toggle command is automatically assigned to ALT+F11

You can assign ALT+F11 and ALT+F12 to wheel buttons under the ALT+ tab in the controls options screen.

5) Screen resolutions for your Oculus Rift.

Now that LFS adjusts the render target texture size to suit the output screen size, you may benefit from downsampling if you select a higher screen resolution than the native resolution of the Rift. This may produce some helpful antialiasing. Try to select a 16:10 resolution (e.g. 1920x1200) because that has the same aspect ratio as the Dev Kit's native resolution (1280x800). If you select a 16:9 resolution (e.g. 1920x1080) you should check carefully that the output image has the correct aspect ratio. This seems to vary between computers. Some have reported that the image looks the same in 1920x1200 and 1920x1080 but others report that 1920x1080 causes the image to be slightly stretched vertically. You need to make sure the dimensions appear the same as when you choose the native resolution of 1280x800. If you find the image is stretched vertically when you use 1920x1080, you can try the Aspect ratio correction option, or look at the GPU scaling setting (in your graphics card driver software).

There is a device selector in LFS which may allow you to put LFS on the Rift without it appearing on your monitor, and to do this without touching any Windows desktop settings. This is probably available when your desktop is set to extended mode. Using the device selector may make more modes available to you than when you use cloned mode.

At the bottom of the Graphics Options screen, just above the Z-buffer depth option, there is a button which has the name of your graphics card. If you click that button you may be able to select the Oculus Rift device which will be used the next time you start LFS.


NOT YET DONE (some of these will be done) :

- render mirrors in 3d
- chromatic aberration correction
- allow head tracking and wheel button instead of mouse
- replay cameras (TV view) may be put on a virtual monitor
- include object selection buttons in SHIFT+U mode


INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS :

A full version of LFS 0.6E must already be installed - www.lfs.net

- Download the test patch (below). It contains an LFS exe and a DLL for the Oculus Rift.
- Open the zip file and drag the specially named LFS exe file into your LFS folder.
- For Oculus Rift support copy LFSOVRDLL.dll (new version) into your LFS folder.

NOTE : You can see if the patch is correctly installed when you run
the program. At the bottom of the entry screen : 0.6E14


DOWNLOAD :

TEST PATCH 0.6E14 (if you already have 0.6E) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_6E14.zip (1.0 MB)

Last edited by Scawen, Fri 31 Jan 2014, 18:35. Reason : E14

Quote from sicotange :

I'm glad 3D support implementation is going well so far. I suppose upcoming patch will focus solely on 3D support? There is no chance you could squeeze the little InSim improvements discussed last year (autocross: no ground level check flag, new flat slab object)? If you decided to ditch this idea could you say so please, because it is fueling some (false?) hope

Hi sicotange, I have not decided to ditch this idea, but I think it will not be available in this patch. As this patch can be kept compatible, it's good to avoid the disruption of an incompatible patch. I still like those ideas though and would like to do it properly at some point.

Quote from Whiskey :

Some years ago you said that making LFS multi-threaded could be done in about 1 month (IIRC). Would it make sense to do this change just after/before the DX9? I know it's impossible to do at the same time because it would be a hell to debug that, but it could be done in the same test patch period to have a mega revamped LFS version once it's done.

I'll understand if you dont want to answer this right now, when you are still implementing the 3D, and sorry for this offtopic post

Well I don't think it's really important at the moment, because we don't suffer from frame rate problems. I can understand that would be good to maintain high frame rates while doing some super graphics, like dynamic clouds and various effects. But it seems a long way off, I know dynamic weather would be great and reward adaptability. But the foundation for this is the tyre physics and after this patch I must focus on the tyre physics. The new version does feel better to drive, because it has a basis in physical simulation.

Quote from acous :

Is there any ETA on the next patch? Will there be a fix for view drift? Neck model? Sorry to be a pain... can't help venting my excitement

I'm hoping this evening. No neck model yet. About view drift, there is a way to assign view centering to a key or a wheel button :
https://www.lfsforum.net/showt ... php?p=1832368#post1832368

I can't actually eliminate view drift, only Oculus VR can do that. But you can press the key or button to centre the view occasionally.

Next test patch updates so far :

General :

Improved coordination of background and text when switching between interface screens

3D Support :

Driver in driver options screen and car in race setup screen are now visible in 3D modes
Move view with animation option is now disabled in 3D modes

Oculus Rift :

Head tracking now works for menu screens and in game HUD
Predictive tracking option now available (zero milliseconds disables prediction)
Render target texture size is automatically selected for the output screen resolution
1g head tilt option is automatically disabled when using Oculus Rift

Fixes :

FIX : Computers that failed to support Rift were prevented from selecting other 3D modes

Quote from cargame.nl :

With VC6? I don't get it anymore, thought that wasn't possible / desired.

Yes, VC6 is pretty good and was used by a lot of people for a long time. There is no problem with DX9 in VC6.

I plan to move onto VS2010 or VS2013 when we are doing a physically incompatible patch. This is just because of the floating point operations that the optimiser rearranges in ways that are mathematically equivalent but don't produce the same result. E.g. compare a*b+a*c and a*(b+c) ... mathematically the same but on a computer this will give different results with certain floating point values due to rounding error. And that would be enough to send 100% of hotlaps OOS within a second and no-one could connect online either. Not a really bit deal but then there is no immediate need to move from VC6 either. When the physics changes, all hotlaps will be OOS and that's a good time to change compiler.

Quote from cargame.nl :

Anyway, I wonder if the InSim buttons can / will be presented in a readable way in 3D.

They will just work the same as everything else. The will appear bigger in the Rift than they do now so should be readable if they are as big as the standard buttons.

Well, what seems not to be clear is this : I'm not about to exclude XP users from LFS.

It's not : "I'm considering it, what do you think?"

It is : "LFS will NOT move past DX9 at this point."

Redman, I understand you disagree, you have the viewpoint "move with the times" and so on, which is exactly the attitude MS wants people to have. But I don't and can't subscribe to that viewpoint. So we will never agree on that.

Shotglass, I am not interested in making LFS work with two different versions of DirectX. All I want to do is finish this 3D stuff and get onto completing the tyre physics, so LFS can actually move on!

EDIT : New test patch 0.6E8 is now available...
https://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=84776


WARNING : THIS IS A TEST

NOTE : THIS DOES NOT CONTAIN NEW TYRE PHYSICS / VW SCIROCCO / ROCKINGHAM

PLEASE TEST BEFORE YOU POST

NO OFF-TOPIC FEATURE REQUESTS

NO UNRELATED COMMENTS


Hello Racers, here is a new TEST PATCH : 0.6E7

You can read about LFS development in the main forum :
https://www.lfsforum.net/showt ... php?p=1823294#post1823294

This test patch is fully compatible with version 0.6E

You cannot upload hotlaps made with this test patch because it is only a test patch, not an official patch.

Please keep a backup of your LFS.exe from 0.6E so you can easily go back if there are any problems.


Changes from 0.6E6 to 0.6E7 :

Oculus Rift :

Added resolution and IPD to info display in view options screen
Head tracking now works in helicopter / follow / SHIFT+U modes

Fixes :

FIX : LFS crashed when changing track in Oculus Rift mode


Changes from 0.6E5 to 0.6E6 :

- External views (TV, helicopter and SHIFT+U) are now available in 3D modes. Note that the mouse control in SHIFT+U mode is not exactly correct in all modes and the autocross editor is not yet available.

- New text commands /rift [on/off/reset] e.g. /rift reset will reset the orientation. This can be assigned to a function key or a wheel button in the controls screen.

- A small amount of status information about the Oculus Rift is displayed on the right of the view options screen including head tracking values if they are available.

- FIX : Selecting 2D or 3D mode did not disable or enable the Oculus Rift if it was the selected 3D device.

- FIX : Oculus Rift now takes priority over TrackIR so there should be no problem with having a TrackIR installed on your computer.


Changes from 0.6E to 0.6E5 :

Support for stereoscopic 3D monitors, projectors, TVs and headsets
Lateral and longitudinal accelerometer values now work realistically
FIX : High frequency changes in acceleration were filtered in OutSim
FIX : Helmet stayed the same after changing driver in MP replays


HOW TO ENABLE STEREOSCOPIC 3D :

1) In the View options screen, select 3D mode on the second line.

2) Select your Display type - three options are available :

- TV / monitor / projector
- Conventional 3D headset
- Oculus Rift

Each mode has different characteristics.

- TV / monitor / projector mode - it is important to set your horizontal screen width, measured in mm. Not the diagonal, just the horizontal measurement from one side to the other. This, in conjunction with the interpupillary distance, should set the image up properly if you set the FOV to match the true horizontal view angle between your eyes and the TV edges. The virtual eye positions are affected and the centres of the two images displayed on the screen are offset by the same distance so the horizon appears to be in the distance.

- Conventional 3D headset - also has an interpupillary distance slider but in this case it only affects the virtual eye positions. I have not coded compensation for the use of wider FOV angles than actually available. So if you use wider FOV than the true horizontal FOV of the device, you will see exaggerated depth.

- Oculus Rift - this will try to load a DLL and connect to your Oculus Rift and from there it will get the interpupillary distance and other values, and head tracking should work.

3) In TV / monitor / projector or Conventional 3D headset modes, select your Format for 3D output - four options are available :

- side by side (half)
- top and bottom (half)
- side by side (full)
- top and bottom (full)

Choose the setting that works with your device. Many devices can accept different input formats.

- side by side (half) is a commonly used format that causes some loss of resolution in the horizontal direction.

- top and bottom (half) causes loss of resolution in the vertical direction. This is the best choice for passive displays with alternating polarisation horizontal scan lines. This type of display discards half of the lines if supplied with a full height image. When supplied with half height images, no further information needs to be discarded.

- side by side (full) and top and bottom (full) can output 3D at full HD resolution to a device that supports this. However, most devices do not support this output (even if they can accept full HD 3D from a Blu-ray player). In Windows XP it was possible to set your desktop across two screens and then LFS could go full screen on two screens. Then side by side (full) could be used, for example, to send output to a twin projector 3D setup. Unfortunately this possibility seems to have been removed from recent versions of Windows.

4) For Oculus Rift mode some text functions have been included.

/rift on - switch on 3D with Oculus Rift as the display type
/rift off - return to 2D mode
/rift reset - reset the orientation

You may wish to assign the command /rift reset to a CTRL + or ALT + F key (and steering wheel button) in the Controls options screen.


NOT YET DONE (some of these will be done) :

- enable predictive tracking
- position hud and menus in 3d space to allow head tracking to look around them
- move eye position depending on the orientation (simple neck model)
- include object selection buttons in SHIFT+U mode
- correct mouse dragging in SHIFT+U mode
- render mirrors in 3d


INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS :

A full version of LFS 0.6E must already be installed - www.lfs.net

- Download the test patch (below). It contains an LFS exe and a DLL for the Oculus Rift.
- Open the zip file and drag the specially named LFS exe file into your LFS folder.
- For Oculus Rift support copy LFSOVRDLL.dll (new version) into your LFS folder.

NOTE : You can see if the patch is correctly installed when you run
the program. At the bottom of the entry screen : 0.6E7


DOWNLOAD :


EDIT : New test patch 0.6E8 is now available...
https://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=84776

Last edited by Scawen, Fri 29 Nov 2013, 21:29. Reason : E8

WARNING : THIS IS A TEST

NOTE : THIS DOES NOT CONTAIN NEW TYRE PHYSICS / VW SCIROCCO / ROCKINGHAM

PLEASE TEST BEFORE YOU POST

NO OFF-TOPIC FEATURE REQUESTS

NO UNRELATED COMMENTS


Hello Racers, here is a new TEST PATCH : 0.6E5

You can read about LFS development in the main forum :
https://www.lfsforum.net/showt ... php?p=1823294#post1823294

This test patch is fully compatible with version 0.6E

You cannot upload hotlaps made with this test patch because it is only a test patch, not an official patch.

Please keep a backup of your LFS.exe from 0.6E so you can easily go back if there are any problems.


Changes from 0.6E4 to 0.6E5 :

Improved stereoscopic 3D support, including experimental Oculus Rift support.

Three 3D modes are available :

- TV / monitor / projector
- Conventional 3D headset
- Oculus Rift

Each mode has different characteristics.

- TV / monitor / projector mode - it is important to set your horizontal screen width, measured in mm. Not the diagonal, just the horizontal measurement from one side to the other. This, in conjunction with the interpupillary distance, should set the image up properly if you set the FOV to match the true horizontal view angle between your eyes and the TV edges. The virtual eye positions are affected and the centres of the two images displayed on the screen are offset by the same distance so the horizon appears to be in the distance.

- Conventional 3D headset - also has an interpupillary distance slider but in this case it only affects the virtual eye positions. I still have not coded compensation for the use of wider FOV angles than actually available. So if you use wider FOV than the true horizontal FOV of the device, you will still see exaggerated depth.

- Oculus Rift - this will try to load a DLL and connect to your Oculus Rift and from there it will get the interpupillary distance and other values, and head tracking should work. It's not supposed to be finished but should basically work. I'd be interested in your comments about the experience and how it compares with other games.


Changes from 0.6E to 0.6E4 :

Stereoscopic 3D support :

In the View Options screen you can select 3D mode on the second line.

Various options will then be available to you :

SBS / TAB - left and right eye images are displayed side by side or top and bottom

half / full - the image is compressed to half width or not compressed

HUD adjustment : Brings the 2D elements closer - this is good for a headset because you can bring the interface as near to you as the steering wheel.

3D adjustment : Makes 3D elements further away - this is good for a TV because the sky and distant objects will appear to be behind your screen.

Notes :

TEST PATCH : THERE ARE NO EXTERNAL VIEWS OR 3D OBJECTS IN THE MENUS WHEN IN 3D MODE

SBS half is a commonly used format and should be available on many 3D TV sets. Horizontal resolution is reduced. Most active shutter displays need to use this option or TAB half. I am interested to know which looks better.

TAB half should be the best option for passive displays which use alternate lines for left and right eye. Vertical resolution is reduced compared with 2D mode but there is no additional loss of resolution on a passive display (which must reduce vertical resolution of a full height image in 3D mode).

SBS full is the closest thing to what is required for an Oculus Rift, but the necessary distortion has not been applied. There is no Oculus Rift tracking support either. You may be able to use intermediate software to use this mode on an Oculus Rift, in which case you should probably use interface scaling to reduce the height of the HUD (Options... Display... Interface).

Other changes :

Lateral and longitudinal accelerometer values now work realistically
FIX : High frequency changes in acceleration were filtered in OutSim
FIX : Helmet stayed the same after changing driver in MP replays


INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS :

A FULL version of LFS 0.6E must already be installed

Open the zip file and drag the specially named LFS exe file into your LFS folder.

NOTE : You can see if the patch is correctly installed when you run
the program. At the bottom of the entry screen : 0.6E5


DOWNLOAD :

TEST PATCH 0.6E5 (ZIP FILE) (if you already have 0.6E) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_6E5.zip (1.0 MB)

OCULUS RIFT DLL (in zip file) (save LFSOVRDLL.dll in your LFS folder) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFSORDLL_ORIGINAL.zip

Last edited by Scawen, Thu 7 Nov 2013, 08:42. Reason : Removed the &quot;alternative&quot; Oculus Rift DLL as the &quot;original&quot; is correct.

The answer to that is here :
https://developer.oculusvr.com ... p;t=95&p=65636#p65636

I'm not ready to produce an incompatible version yet. And for all I know, later compilers may cause other unforeseen problems. It's not a good thought also while I'm maintaining two branches of LFS and have to merge all changes into both versions. Much better to get the new tyre physics out and *then* look at modernising.

You could turn down the User LOD or other options in Graphics Options such as low res shadows and low res textures.

In Misc Options, make sure Multiplayer speedup option is enabled, reduce Multiplayer car draw and increase the Dynamic LOD reduction.

Is it the physics or the graphics that is causing the slowdown? Test with a multiplayer replay - is the frame rate a lot higher when you press pause? In that case maybe the physics is the problem and you don't need to reduce the Graphics Options.

WARNING : THIS IS A TEST

NOTE : THIS DOES NOT CONTAIN NEW TYRE PHYSICS / VW SCIROCCO / ROCKINGHAM

PLEASE TEST BEFORE YOU POST

NO OFF-TOPIC FEATURE REQUESTS

NO UNRELATED COMMENTS


Hello Racers, here is a new TEST PATCH : 0.6E4

You can read about LFS development in the main forum :
https://www.lfsforum.net/showt ... php?p=1823294#post1823294

This test patch is fully compatible with version 0.6E

You cannot upload hotlaps made with this test patch because it is only a test patch, not an official patch.

Please keep a backup of your LFS.exe from 0.6E so you can easily go back if there are any problems.


Changes from 0.6E to 0.6E4 :

Stereoscopic 3D support :

In the View Options screen you can select 3D mode on the second line.

Various options will then be available to you :

SBS / TAB - left and right eye images are displayed side by side or top and bottom

half / full - the image is compressed to half width or not compressed

HUD adjustment : Brings the 2D elements closer - this is good for a headset because you can bring the interface as near to you as the steering wheel.

3D adjustment : Makes 3D elements further away - this is good for a TV because the sky and distant objects will appear to be behind your screen.

Notes :

TEST PATCH : THERE ARE NO EXTERNAL VIEWS OR 3D OBJECTS IN THE MENUS WHEN IN 3D MODE

SBS half is a commonly used format and should be available on many 3D TV sets. Horizontal resolution is reduced. Most active shutter displays need to use this option or TAB half. I am interested to know which looks better.

TAB half should be the best option for passive displays which use alternate lines for left and right eye. Vertical resolution is reduced compared with 2D mode but there is no additional loss of resolution on a passive display (which must reduce vertical resolution of a full height image in 3D mode).

SBS full is the closest thing to what is required for an Oculus Rift, but the necessary distortion has not been applied. There is no Oculus Rift tracking support either. You may be able to use intermediate software to use this mode on an Oculus Rift, in which case you should probably use interface scaling to reduce the height of the HUD (Options... Display... Interface).

Other changes :

Lateral and longitudinal accelerometer values now work realistically
FIX : High frequency changes in acceleration were filtered in OutSim
FIX : Helmet stayed the same after changing driver in MP replays


INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS :

A FULL version of LFS 0.6E must already be installed

Open the zip file and drag the specially named LFS exe file into your LFS folder.

NOTE : You can see if the patch is correctly installed when you run
the program. At the bottom of the entry screen : 0.6E4


DOWNLOAD :

TEST PATCH 0.6E4 (ZIP FILE) (if you already have 0.6E) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_6E4.zip (1.0 MB)

Hello everyone!

The developers are all alive and working on LFS.

Eric has been working on new tracks. He slowed up a bit during some of the great English summer which we don't get very often. I have enjoyed test driving on two of his new tracks which look great and I look forward to the time when they can be released.

I am still working on the tyre physics, though I haven't really made serious progress this year. I also enjoyed the summer, did a lot of cycling and running too. It's a better hobby than smoking like I used to, and I really enjoy it. But the good news is it won't pay the bills!

LFS income has gradually gone down as it always does between updates. That that has increased the urgency of finishing the tyre physics. So I plan to get down to it, make the appropriate approximations and sort out a good physically based system, with enough assumptions to make it workable, accepting that total realism is an unachievable goal.

I just got a bit excited about stereoscopic 3d support, which some people will like because they'll be able to see LFS in 3d on a 3d TV, if their TV supports "side-by-side" or "top and bottom" mode. Also headsets should be supported if they accept one of those output modes. The old headsets that require specific support and sequential output will not be supported. For example a Sony HMZ works but a Vuzix VR920 does not. A more recent Vuzix should work but the field of view is not really good enough to give you peripheral vision. I'm not sure how much it will benefit the Oculus Rift at the moment. I think that depends on a pixel shader to provide the proper distortion, which I think is not available in D3D8. Anyway, one of the output options will be non-squashed (full) side-by-side 3D, which may possibly make it easier to use the Oculus Rift. Anyway it is a step in that direction. It does appear that the current Oculus Rift's resolution is too low for a racing simulator at the moment. Anyway I should be able to post a 3d test patch in a few days, I'm guessing early next week. Some people will enjoy that, though I realise most people, like me, don't have 3d equipment.

Victor is still with us, although he has indeed got another job, which looks like a really good one, putting his excellent skills to more use. I'm pleased for him about that, as his job here wasn't often really full time, although he is an absolutely vital member of our team. He needed a job as well because our profit share isn't one third each and depends on our actual contributions to the project. Victor started later and never has so much work, so for that reason only, his profit share was a bit of a tight squeeze to live on, specially with the gradual reduction in profits while we are waiting for a serious update.

People ask why I don't come here more often with progress reports. But there hasn't been enough progress to give a report. And it's not appealing to come here and say that. Every month I've thought I would be making more progress, and would have some good progress to report the following month. Hope you see what I mean...

Anyway, we do have to pay the bills and I'm very interested to get the better feeling tyre model out there for everyone to enjoy. You've heard it all before so I don't expect great enthusiasm. It will take a while yet, but hopefully not too long.

Quote from Matrixi :

What about implementing an ingame skin uploader feature?

Well that sounds quite difficult and I think it's really ok to use the existing web system.

Besides, this is just a quick update I can do for hosts to install if they wish. There is no new patch coming out with new in-game features. I have editor functions and tyre physics to work on.

Quote from The Very End :

Thanks for that answer, just two more fast before I'll crawl back under the rock

1: Se above, about the skin(s) - possible (the one question about using LFSs skins intead of white)?
2: If I struggle with DCs, then TCP would be best choise? My problem is that every 10 minutes or so I get a 10-15 second net "lock". This is due to some router problem I have not yet discovered why, but never more than 15 seconds it seems. 50% of the times it goes ok, but other times I get back after the 15 seconds - see all the cars and everything is fine, but I still lose connection to server some seconds later. It seems as it has problems connecting to the server again.
Again, I should try TCP here?

1) I really can't see a problem with the system I'm coding. A player who joins by mistake with a skin that he forgot to upload is immediately spectated with a simple message. It's not rude, harsh or extreme. So he can choose an appropriate skin to join with, and will appear the same on his computer and everyone else's.

2) No, if you use TCP for position packets, you are more likely to be disconnected from the host. The "game packets" that keep you in sync always use TCP. If you flood that system with position packets, and you have a bad connection, you may end up failing to maintain the game connection. The normal UDP packets can be lost without affecting your connection to the host.